Author Topic: ammo and ammo reload supplies shortage  (Read 1174 times)

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Offline bob

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ammo and ammo reload supplies shortage
« on: February 12, 2021, 10:00AM »
I wanted to practice a bit more this year before matches.  it has been gripe of mine to always realize that i could had done better had i practice this or that.  but now a practice session is off the table.  if you read online and magazines it seems like this is not an issue for most.  I guess most people saw this coming and bought in bulk.
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Re: ammo and ammo reload supplies shortage
« Reply #1 on: February 12, 2021, 02:10PM »
With the talk that supplies may not come back until some time next year, it could be a very limited season. Of course, if you're willing to pay a King's Ransom, you can get supplies and ammo. I always thought I was well stocked. I always had enough to get through about a year of shooting. But always knew I could get more when needed. I was easily going through 7500+ rounds/yr between all the matches and practice. Now, who knows when we can get anything. So whatever I have, may have to last a year or more.
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Re: ammo and ammo reload supplies shortage
« Reply #2 on: February 12, 2021, 05:10PM »
Seems more and more going to .22lr just to make sure have enough of center fire. Decent stock of powder and bullets but yeah worry about primers. Heard at a gun show selling for 100.00 for 100! And people were buying.
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Re: ammo and ammo reload supplies shortage
« Reply #3 on: February 12, 2021, 07:32PM »
Look on Gunbroker and see what reloading supplies are going for. And people are buying it at those outrageous prices. With factory ammo going for almost $50/box of 50, imagine shooting a normal USPSA match? It'll cost you almost $200 in ammo alone. :nopuede

Maybe we need a new division in USPSA-Airsoft.  :thinking Use paper targets instead of carboard. Desperate times, call for desperate measures.
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Offline bob

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Re: ammo and ammo reload supplies shortage
« Reply #4 on: February 12, 2021, 08:10PM »
air soft is not a bad idea.  Even with no ammo shortage an uspsa airsoft match could be super cool
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Re: ammo and ammo reload supplies shortage
« Reply #5 on: February 17, 2021, 07:54AM »
I had brought up this before about Airsoft. I thought to use it as a basement range and easy to use.  It can be used for practice and now it might be the only thing that can be used for practice. Based on what I have been seeing it may be that we won't be okay till 2023 and if I go for the doom and gloom we may never see prices that are fair ever again. The worst part for me is that this is the first year my kid can do center fire matches locally. I might get  airsoft for me and let him use 22 or both of us will use 22 just in case this gets worse.

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Re: ammo and ammo reload supplies shortage
« Reply #6 on: February 17, 2021, 10:49AM »
This is how high stakes Hold'em will be played soon.
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Offline bob

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Re: ammo and ammo reload supplies shortage
« Reply #7 on: February 17, 2021, 04:59PM »
I am thankful I did not sell my lead bullet casting equipment.  It may help me survive a bit more, even if I have to pay triple for primers
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Offline DM

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ammo and ammo reload supplies shortage
« Reply #8 on: February 17, 2021, 08:45PM »
Reputable suppliers are not gouging that bad. But they are limiting to 1k or 5k which really impacts pricing with hazmat and shipping. Check your usual places daily, you will eventually get lucky.


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Re: ammo and ammo reload supplies shortage
« Reply #9 on: February 18, 2021, 08:23PM »
Well, with all this snow we've been getting, not able to shoot anyways. I think Lipsa has cancelled 3 matches in a row so far. So I'm not feeling so bad with my limited ammo and reloading supplies.
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Offline bob

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Re: ammo and ammo reload supplies shortage
« Reply #10 on: February 19, 2021, 12:37PM »
Hmm

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Offline bob

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Re: ammo and ammo reload supplies shortage
« Reply #11 on: February 19, 2021, 12:46PM »
Hmm

Needless to say like everything else used this at your own risk.  But I like his thinking
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Re: ammo and ammo reload supplies shortage
« Reply #12 on: February 19, 2021, 12:50PM »
Oh boy. I see the wheels spinning in Bob's head.  :shocked
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Re: ammo and ammo reload supplies shortage
« Reply #13 on: February 19, 2021, 01:24PM »
Hmm

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Re: ammo and ammo reload supplies shortage
« Reply #14 on: February 19, 2021, 01:27PM »
Hmm

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Re: ammo and ammo reload supplies shortage
« Reply #15 on: February 19, 2021, 02:17PM »
Since you seem determined to explore reloading primers, here's another method that was posted on BE. Seems the idea is running through everyone's head. This is going to lead to many accidents happening, which will be touted as gun related accidents by the liberals.


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Re: ammo and ammo reload supplies shortage
« Reply #16 on: February 20, 2021, 12:54PM »
That is so annoying with the go pro on his head. Interesting idea though.
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Re: ammo and ammo reload supplies shortage
« Reply #17 on: February 21, 2021, 01:11PM »
Has anyone tried making their own primers here? I have seen another video that showed you how to make a paste from matche heads. What would be the risk? The time it takes is also something that has to be considered but I have time.

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Re: ammo and ammo reload supplies shortage
« Reply #18 on: February 21, 2021, 02:27PM »
Quote
Has anyone tried making their own primers here? .?................ What would be the risk? 
Only blowing yourself up. It's no different than making your own fireworks. I think most of these videos make reference to assembling them during a so-called zombie apocalypse, when there's no chance of getting any supplies. Of course, if you didn't have a few thousand rounds of ammo stashed for such an apocalypse, then you deserve to be eaten.
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Offline bob

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Re: ammo and ammo reload supplies shortage
« Reply #19 on: February 21, 2021, 03:25PM »
i Think the main issue is quality control and consistency of the end product.  If you loads are mild it maybe safe in  the blow-on-your face department.  Some loads may fizzle, some may spike in psi and some may just not go off at all I imagine.  I would love to see a machine that would allow for this to be done more consistently.  The problem ther is that you are dealing with an explosive.  Smokeless powder is not an explosive.  It burns quick and hot but it will not go boom.  But primers or even the concoction of matches and the igniter powder is an explosive, albeit mild and likely harmless.  So all it takes is for someone to lose an eye or a finger or two and someone is getting sue. So I don't expect reloading equipment for primers ever to be produced and marketed to us peasants
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Offline cas

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Re: ammo and ammo reload supplies shortage
« Reply #20 on: February 21, 2021, 05:48PM »
Unless you have NO primers, and you need to go hunt something so you don't starve, no thanks.

« Last Edit: February 21, 2021, 06:00PM by cas »
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Re: ammo and ammo reload supplies shortage
« Reply #21 on: February 21, 2021, 07:17PM »
It's not your loads that may blow up in your face, it's the actual making of the primers. You saw in the video, how careful they said to not shake up the mixture too hard, or else it can go off.
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Re: ammo and ammo reload supplies shortage
« Reply #22 on: February 21, 2021, 08:01PM »
Have been randomly checking for primers, and have not seen them anywhere. Only place they're available is on Gunbroker, for ridiculous prices like here: https://www.gunbroker.com/item/892835334 Current bid $1,225/5,000.  :shocked At these prices, I really don't see me shooting matches anymore. Can't be spending $200-$300 in ammo to shoot a match. It's a really sad situation, the slow death of our sport, because of people's greed and hoarding.   :(
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Offline cas

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Re: ammo and ammo reload supplies shortage
« Reply #23 on: February 21, 2021, 08:34PM »
I'd sell 5k for $1200

No way to ship them unless you do it illegally like most of those sellers probably are.
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Re: ammo and ammo reload supplies shortage
« Reply #24 on: February 21, 2021, 09:50PM »
$24 for a box of 100.  Yikes

I remember the days when I used to pay $10 at good old Chester and I thought he was robbing me blind
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Re: ammo and ammo reload supplies shortage
« Reply #25 on: February 22, 2021, 09:58AM »
So $50 for primers add about $5 of powder and say you picked up your brass for free.  $20 worth of bullet heads, $25 for a match and say $15 in gas.  That is $100 plus a match.  Evil might win by attrition.  I never saw that coming
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Re: ammo and ammo reload supplies shortage
« Reply #26 on: February 22, 2021, 01:53PM »
So $50 for primers add about $5 of powder and say you picked up your brass for free.  $20 worth of bullet heads, $25 for a match and say $15 in gas.  That is $100 plus a match.  Evil might win by attrition.  I never saw that coming
It'll be at least $25-$30 in gas for me, by the time Biden get's done destroying our energy independance, and gas is $4/gal.   :cascrying
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Re: ammo and ammo reload supplies shortage
« Reply #27 on: February 24, 2021, 06:13PM »
ila_rendered
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Re: ammo and ammo reload supplies shortage
« Reply #28 on: February 24, 2021, 06:16PM »
Look at the buy now

$400 for 1k

That is $0.40 per primer.  That is more than loaded ammo back circa 2019
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Re: ammo and ammo reload supplies shortage
« Reply #29 on: February 24, 2021, 06:18PM »
This is bad
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Re: ammo and ammo reload supplies shortage
« Reply #30 on: February 24, 2021, 06:31PM »
Remember this auction for 5K primers? https://www.gunbroker.com/item/892835334 They sold for $1,296. Over $.25 a primer.   :diosmio3
And it's because there are people stupid enough to pay those prices, that we will continue to see shortages, and ridiculously high prices.
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Re: ammo and ammo reload supplies shortage
« Reply #31 on: February 25, 2021, 10:01AM »
This the first time ever that everything I own gun related, I can make a substantial profit if I decide to sell.
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Re: ammo and ammo reload supplies shortage
« Reply #32 on: February 25, 2021, 04:57PM »
The higher prices are here to stay. The ammo and component companies are little by little all falling under single ownership, more brands owned by single companies, all of which owned by one holding company. (example: Hodgdon now controls Hodgdon powders, Winchester powders, Ramshot, Western/Accurate)  So they will be "other companies" in name only, not really competitors. There will be no pricing wars, and now that they have a better idea of what people are willing to pay, there's no need to bring them back to where they were. And don't expect any help or sympathy from the .Gov about monopolies and price controls.
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Re: ammo and ammo reload supplies shortage
« Reply #33 on: February 26, 2021, 12:01PM »
This is a “test” — ok
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Re: ammo and ammo reload supplies shortage
« Reply #34 on: February 26, 2021, 12:10PM »
For what ever reason it would net let me post the message before. It looked like it was.

They wanted 30.00 a box of 9 but I figured I would look. Thankfully I was not really going to buy any but today I learned that I did not even stand a chance.

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Re: ammo and ammo reload supplies shortage
« Reply #35 on: February 26, 2021, 01:17PM »
Do me a favor and try again from your iPhone

Should be fine now.  I don’t have a quick way to replicate the issue but I think I fixed it
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Re: ammo and ammo reload supplies shortage
« Reply #36 on: February 26, 2021, 01:22PM »
Very interesting post.  I hear rumors the government is buying all the ammo... rumors and likely conspiracy theory all, but 100k rounds sold in 60 seconds that is insane.  Think about it.  It takes about 20 seconds To select and checkout and confirm your order.  And I disagree.  If they limit to to 1000, even if takes 10 seconds to checkout, for 100k that is more than 15 minutes and a half for one person to buy it all.  Giving others a chance to get some
« Last Edit: February 26, 2021, 01:42PM by bob »
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Re: ammo and ammo reload supplies shortage
« Reply #37 on: February 26, 2021, 01:41PM »
As requested copy and paste again from Android.


Fenixammo
Training   Competition   Defensive   Frangible
                  A Quick Follow-Up on Yesterday’s Inventory Listing

Considering the current demand and the number of customers who were not able to complete their purchase yesterday, we wanted to provide some data as to the size of the problem we are trying to solve as well as answer some basic questions:

Q: Did you actually list anything yesterday?  Or, ever?  I never seem to be able to get any ammo.

A:  On February 25th we listed 300,000 total rounds listed at 10AM EST, just as we said we would.  100,000 9mm 115gr were sold in under 60 seconds; 100,000 9mm 147gr were sold in under 110 seconds; 100,000 9mm 124gr were sold in 2 minutes and 45 seconds.

Our last inventory update on February 11th took approximately five minutes to sell the same quantity of ammunition.  So far in 2020 we have posted four separate inventory updates totaling 1.2 million rounds which have lasted a combined total of 20 minutes.  We do not expect things to change in the near future.

Q:  There must be a small number of wholesalers buying up all the ammo to resell at higher prices.  Can you put a limit on quantity?

A:  We could, but this is not what is happening.  Yesterday we processed 568 orders, which means the average order was approximately 500-750 rounds.  Even if we limited orders to 1,000 rounds it would not have changed the outcome in any significant manner.  Our in-stock notifications had more than 50,000 signups in February alone and there is simply not enough to go around.

Q:  I think there are people using bots or automated accounts to check out quicker than other people.  Can you put a stop to this?

A:  We know some people are quicker than others, but we have no evidence that they are using bots or automated tools.  Even if they are, we are not sure how to solve that issue aside from adding more layers of onerous check boxes or captcha-type security to our checkout process.  Unfortunately, our ecommerce platform does not offer this type of security and we are not going to move our website to a different platform just to solve this issue.

Q:  How can I speed up the checkout process?

A:  There are two things you can do – first, create an account on our site.  When you are logged in, your shipping information will be pre-loaded in the checkout process.  Second, use Google or Apple to save your credit card information on your phone, tablet, or computer.  This way, you can eliminate having to manually enter the information.  For security purposes, we do not have a way to save payment information on our site, so you will need to use a third party service on your device to do so.

Q:  I had ammo in my cart, and before I could enter my credit card information, it disappeared.  What’s the deal?

A:  The shopping cart does not “protect” your purchase until payment has been processed. We do not have the ability to add a protection timer to our website.  We are a small business, not Ticketmaster or Bud’s Guns. We don’t have a full-time staff of web developers.  At this time we do not have a solution for this problem and we do not anticipate having a solution in the near future. 

Q:  Can’t you guys work faster, put out more ammo, update inventory on a more regular basis, etc.?

A:  Guys – if we could, we would.  We are working on automating our quality control process to a greater degree and we are working to eliminate some inefficiencies in our process, but the supply chain is still a limiting factor and it will not be resolved any time in 2021.  Rest assured we are not sitting on a warehouse full of ammo or components, just waiting to see people struggle.  Component prices have gone up on EVERY SINGLE ORDER WE HAVE PLACED with our suppliers in the last eight months.  We are a small company, and we can only control a small part of the manufacturing process. 

Q:  Can I just give you my credit card information NOW, and you can ship me ammo when you have some available?

A:  Sorry, we really wish we could take pre-orders, but we cannot.  If we took a pre-order from every person who has asked us to do so, we would never have anything to list on our website.  We get hundreds of these requests every month and all of them get turned down.  We are trying to keep the playing field as level as we can.

Q:  Where is the defensive 9mm ammo?

A:  We likely will not have defensive ammo available for at least a year.  We cannot get the projectiles we need from Speer.  We are looking into sourcing our own independently manufactured projectile, but this is a process that will take time, and we have many other issues that require our attention at this moment.

Q:  I used to be able to buy your ammo for much cheaper.  Why are you guys “price gouging”?

A:  If you think ammo prices are going up for no reason, we are not sure what to tell you.  The demand is outrageous – worse than the industry has ever seen.  The supply of components is nearly nonexistent, and thus, the prices of those components have gone up significantly to the manufacturers.  We are paying six to seven times the price for primers that we were paying in February 2020 – IF we can get them at all. 

We really wish we could get back to normal, but that is not likely to happen any time soon.



We thank all of you for your support and continued patronage during these crazy times. 
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Re: ammo and ammo reload supplies shortage
« Reply #38 on: February 26, 2021, 01:42PM »
What you did allowed me to post the entire message.

Offline bob

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Re: ammo and ammo reload supplies shortage
« Reply #39 on: February 26, 2021, 01:43PM »
8) thanks
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Re: ammo and ammo reload supplies shortage
« Reply #40 on: February 26, 2021, 02:43PM »
300,000 rounds total in about 2 minutes is nothing. They processed 568 orders. They had 50,000 people signed up for in stock notifications. Remember that time we signed up for either Area 8 or Mid Atlantic match? 400 slots sold out in less than 15 minutes.
No, it's not the Government buying up the ammo. But paniced people who are letting their fears run things.
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Re: ammo and ammo reload supplies shortage
« Reply #41 on: February 26, 2021, 03:14PM »
Bob big difference between pre registering and just waiting for an open slot.  And actually getting an email, going into the site and checking out.  That takes time.  Just my opinion
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Re: ammo and ammo reload supplies shortage
« Reply #42 on: February 26, 2021, 05:18PM »
Again, 300,000 total rounds sold. If everyone bought 1,000 rounds, that's just 300 people.  The whole country is just waiting on any online place to buy ammo. It's no surprise it sold out so fast.
And even the police are having trouble getting ammo. Training, and yearly qualification shooting has been cut in half.

That being said, I'll sell 1K SPP for 1 Bitcoin. Going once....going twice......   :money  Hey, I can be a greedy F.... too.
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Re: ammo and ammo reload supplies shortage
« Reply #43 on: February 26, 2021, 05:28PM »
I will give you $120 for 1k and a handshake

And a promise not to sell it on gunbroker for like $400
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Re: ammo and ammo reload supplies shortage
« Reply #44 on: February 26, 2021, 06:16PM »
 :laughlol If I'm going to sell my only primers, I'm going to sell them for a King's Ransom and get rich quick. 
« Last Edit: February 26, 2021, 06:20PM by Postal Bob »
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Re: ammo and ammo reload supplies shortage
« Reply #45 on: February 26, 2021, 08:53PM »
These are bad times, bad times I says
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Re: ammo and ammo reload supplies shortage
« Reply #46 on: February 27, 2021, 12:32AM »
 :bLaugh

I might have enough for two revolver matches as well.  So that takes me to 5 matches I can attend plus one or two 22 matches.  So I think Evil is running for them hills
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Re: ammo and ammo reload supplies shortage
« Reply #47 on: February 27, 2021, 08:49AM »
.38 and .45 is what I have the most of loaded, since I barely shoot those. But now it may be what is needed. But those guns are usually relegated to the Defensive pistol matches.
And also .22's. I love dedicated 22 matches, but would feel odd shooting a 22 in a regular USPSA match.
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Re: ammo and ammo reload supplies shortage
« Reply #48 on: February 27, 2021, 04:40PM »
Yeah 22lr for the defensive and steel challenge matches and dedicated 22 matches
« Last Edit: February 27, 2021, 05:12PM by bob »
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Re: ammo and ammo reload supplies shortage
« Reply #49 on: March 18, 2021, 08:11AM »
Well did a hard look at my ammo.  Looks like I will be shooting single stack only this year, for the exception of one match in open.  All I have is large  rifle primers.  I do have a limited gun in 45 acp, but that has a trigger job which will make every shot a 50% chance of failure to ignite.  Also my 1911 is a bit tougher and can handle whatever I feed it.  Plus if there are damages, less expensive to fix.

So I am 100% covered for this season of Evil fighting.  Glad I never got stock with one platform and division.  Right now not having small pistol primers means all the other divisions are out.

 :guapofighter  but it ain’t over
« Last Edit: March 18, 2021, 08:29AM by bob »
I Fear No Evil, for you are with me

Online Postal Bob

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Re: ammo and ammo reload supplies shortage
« Reply #50 on: March 18, 2021, 09:05AM »
Similar situation. Though I do also have 9mm, so I'll also shoot single stack minor. I have some 40 S&W, which I'll save for bigger matches like Spring Blast.
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Re: ammo and ammo reload supplies shortage
« Reply #51 on: April 19, 2021, 09:31PM »
For fun, i browsed Gunbroker for current pricing on primers. They're averaging about $325-$350/1,000. That is still crazy pricing, and at least 10 times the price they were when I bought them about 1 1/2 years ago.   :nono
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Re: ammo and ammo reload supplies shortage
« Reply #52 on: April 20, 2021, 09:01AM »
It is brutal out there
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Re: ammo and ammo reload supplies shortage
« Reply #53 on: April 20, 2021, 01:10PM »
It is official

Did my inventory

4/25 - defensive
Spring Blast
Classifier match

After that i am out.  Doing motorcycle riding and house hunting in the good old south.  I might come back late in the fall.  Hoping we are out of this Ammo funk by then
I Fear No Evil, for you are with me